David meets Solomon's mother (Bathsheba) in Jerusalem (2 Samuel 11:1-3). Less than eight years old. She was eight when she had her first child. (Talmud Tractate Sanhedrin 69b). Father of Bathsheba, whose first husband was a Hittite, 1 Samuel 11:3 (= 1 Chronicles 3:5 , where Eliam is called Ammiel ). We will use two main sources for this: 2 Samuel and Psalm 55 (though other books will also be used). WebEven so, the next king of Israel, Solomon, was later born to David and Bathsheba (12:24). The reader should recall that Hushai the Arkite was the double-agent in 2 Samuel 17 who persuaded Absalom to ignore Ahithophels advice on how to fight David. The Bible simply doesnt say. Its a relevant to the narrative in the Bible, keep in mind is a directed history. It is not a 100% record but rather Dr. J. Vernon McGee, in a commentary he gave on Thru the Bible Radio, also identified the betrayal by Ahithophel as the subject of the psalm,[48] and so does Eastons Bible Dictionary (among many others). She was most likely between the ages of 12-14, which means a 40 year old man married such a young girl. 25:3). He reigned for 40 years. for so we find with David, king of Israel, who learned from Ahitophel no more than two things, yet called him his master, his guide and his beloved friend, as it is said, But it was you, a man mine equal, my guide and my beloved friend (Psalms 55:14)., [52] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-23.htm, [53] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-23.htm, [54] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/gill/psalms/55.htm, [55] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jtc/psalms-55.html#23, [56] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/clarke/psalms/55.htm, So we find, if there be an appointed time to man upon earth, beyond which he cannot pass; yet he may so live as to provoke the justice of God to cut him off before he arrives at that period; yea, before he has reached half way to that limit. It was common enough for the women to marry as young as 15, she was possibly 1518 when [88] Many commentators also say this, including Barnes,[89] Trapp,[90] George Haydock,[91] Bullinger,[92] and the Jamiesson-Fausset-Brown Commentary. He [David] now remembers that, at the heart of Absaloms rebellion, giving it direction and force, indeed making it possible, is Ahithophel., [33] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/spurgeon_charles/tod/ps055.cfm?a=533001, It would be idle to fix a time, and find an occasion for this Psalm with any dogmatism. Was it not inspired? Note that this estimate is higher than the age assigned to Ahithophel by the Jewish sages. The fact is that the context fits well with Absaloms revolt and especially with Ahithophels betrayal of David. 11-18), God says of the future Israelite kings, he will take.. Excuse me author but can you also respond to the claims that a sheep ate the Quran. The bottom line is that there is no evidence to support the claim that there were two Eliams. [45] John MacArthur, The MacArthur Bible Commentary (Nashville: Thomas Nelson, Inc., 2005), p. 636. [67] Therefore, it is reasonable to assume that the average lifespan at the time was around 7080 years (note that this is a very generous assumption). When she came to him, he had sex with her. How[c] could I go home and eat, drink, and have sex with my wife? They will vociferously deny that Bathsheba was around 7 years old (or perhaps as old as 9) when she first encountered David and they will deny that she was the granddaughter of Ahithophel. [13] Most commentaries also share this view, including Barnes Notes on the Bible,[14] Coffmans Commentaries on the Bible,[15] the Expository Notes by Dr. Thomas Constable,[16] E.W. Dimensions: 22 1/2 x 30 in. The Cambridge Bible for Schools and Colleges concurs: Much of the Psalm is sufficiently appropriate to Davids circumstances to account for its having been regarded as an expression of his feelings at that bitter crisis: but a closer examination makes it difficult, if not impossible, to suppose that it was actually written by him. Note that the dictionary does not deny that Ahithophel was Bathshebas granddaughter or that he was the subject of Psalm 55. Rather, Ahithophel must be the close friend, since he was Davids counselor. David was sinful because he had taken another mans wife, not that he had slept with a 7-year old. Thus, Bathsheba could have been around 12-14 years old at the time of the birth of Solomon, which means that she was around 10-12 years old at the time David first encountered her. you have contributed so much great eye opening articles making Muslims and Christians aware of such controversial subjects. [69] https://www.biblestudytools.com/dictionaries/smiths-bible-dictionary/ahithophel.html. Why didnt you go home?, 11 The chest and Israel and Judah are all living in tents, Uriah told David. In fact, Ahithophel is mentioned along with Hushai the Arkite in 1 Chronicles 27:33: Ahithophel was the kings counselor. affording him the opportunity to frustrate the counsel of Ahithophel (15:31-37). [78] Finally, in Acts 13:22, God is quoted as testifying about David as a man after my own heart. Ahithophel was succeeded by Jehoiada son of Benaiah and by Abiathar.. The oldest man in the Bible, after the patriarchs, was Jehoiada, who supposedly died at the age of 130 (2 Chronicles 24:15). [74] https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H5288&t=KJV, [75] https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H7390&t=KJV, [76] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jfu/2-chronicles-24.html#15, [79] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tu_quoque. [66] Saul also lived into his seventies. The recorded events of Davids life after his misconduct with Bathsheba cannot have occupied less than about twenty years; that is, he cannot have been at the time older than about fifty years. No age is mentioned, but Based on the example of Barzillai, 80 years seems to have been the upper limit of life in Davids time. I am the author, and I have already debunked IC on Rebekah. This is where Psalm 55 comes in. WebBathshebas husband Uriah was back to war, so they were married over a year. This was also the conclusion of Jewish and Christian commentators. Bathsheba did not take a ritual bath when she was spied on. This brings us to the most crucial point of our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age. [1] https://quranandbibleblog.wordpress.com/2020/06/10/the-age-of-marriage-in-the-bible/. Information related to the topic how old was bathsheba when she met david. The inevitable happened, and Bathsheba sent word to David that she was pregnant. Actually, God had no problem with it. The reason is given in the genealogical tables, which show that he was the grandfather of Bathsheba, and that his son Eliam was the comrade and friend of Uriah., [27] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/tpc/2-samuel-15.html#1, Ahithophel, the grandfather of Bathsheba (2 Samuel 15:12; 2 Samuel:3), [29] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/barnes/psalms/55.htm, [30] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/psalms/55-13.htm, [31] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/poole/psalms/55.htm, that person who was the chief contriver and promoter of this rebellion under Absalom, even to Ahithophel, of whom he spoke [in] Psalm 55:13; and though he doth not excuse the rest, as we have seen, yet he lays the chief blame upon him, and here he adds new aggravations of his treason.. If this was the normal lifespan at the time, and the bloodthirsty and deceitful will not live out half their days, then we can reasonably estimate Ahithophels age to less than 40 years. Uriah the Hittite and Eliam, being both of the kings guard (consisting of 37 officers), were intimate, and Uriah married the daughter of his brother officer (https://www.studylight.org/dictionaries/fbd/a/ahithophel.html). This was also the conclusion of the classical Jewish sources, such as the Targums and the Talmud, as explained in Gills Exposition of the Entire Bible: But it was thou,. [105] This agrees with Biblical standards as well. The plain reading of the text makes it unlikely. In this article. In response, God warns through Samuel the prophet that kings are takers. The son of Ahithophel (2 Samuel 23:34). They shall live as long as the Lord of life, the righteous Judge, has appointed, with whom the number of our months is; but he has determined to cut them off by an untimely death in the midst of their days., [58] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/spurgeon_charles/tod/ps055.cfm?a=533023, A wicked man never lives out half his days; for either he is cut off before he hath lived half the course of nature, or he is cut off before he hath lived a quarter of the course of his desires; either he lives not half so long as he would; and therefore let him die when he will, his death is full of terror, trouble, and confusion, because he dies out of season. IT experts since 1997. 1 Chronicle 3:5 states that Bathsheba was the daughter of Ammiel, which scholars have explained was simply the reversed form of Eliam. And the arabic word Makr is used meaning plan, not deceive. (LogOut/ Thus, he went back to his home and hanged himself (2 Samuel 17:23). [71] After returning to Jerusalem, Absalom lived there for another 2 years. In the case of Ahithophel, not only was his wise council rejected by Absalom (55:9), he also committed met a violent and untimely death by suicide (55:23). Yet, this objection is based on some flawed premises: why is it assumed that Ahithophel needed to be older than David? Medium: Oil on wood. One night in Jerusalem, King David was walking upon his rooftop when he spotted a beautiful woman bathing nearby (2 Samuel 11:2). He could have been as old as 11 years if we assume that the four years in 2 Samuel 15:7 refers to the time from Absaloms return from Geshur (2+3+2+4=11). There is disagreement among the experts as to what age that should be. Uriah. Bath-sheba was the granddaughter of Ahithophel 2 Samuel 23:34., [90] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/jtc/2-samuel-11.html#3, [91] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/hcc/2-samuel-11.html#3, By a transposition of letters, he is called Ammiel, in 1 Paralipomenon iii. He lived well past half [the] days of the normal lifespan. Using Psalm 55:23, it would mean that Ahithophel could not have gone past the age of 45 years (note again that this is the conservative estimate). [4] Sanhedrin 69b, https://www.sefaria.org/Sanhedrin.69b.11?lang=bi. [] Altogether it seems to us to relate to that mournful era when the King was betrayed by his trusted counsellor., [34] https://www.blueletterbible.org/Comm/smith_chuck/c2000_Psa/Psa_051.cfm?a=533001, Now David evidently wrote this psalm when he was fleeing from Absalom. Rather, by the onset of puberty, they were adults and were treated as such. But what if we can use the Bible to reliably estimate the age of another famous female character in the Bible: But how did the rabbis come to this conclusion if the Bible does not directly provide such information? 6 Then David sent a message to Joab: Send me Uriah the Hittite. So Joab sent Uriah to David. Could you also so a video refuting Islam Critiqued on the age of Mary. 24. (LogOut/ But, God called Bathsheba his own, worthy of legacy of his Son. This view was based on the Quran, which states regarding the orphans who have not reached the marriageable age (emphasis ours): And do not give the weak-minded your property, which Allah has made a means of sustenance for you, but provide for them with it and clothe them and speak to them words of appropriate kindness. The reality is that they were the most likely the same person. And Allah (Glorified and Exalted be He) knows best! But what if we can use the Bible to reliably estimate the age of another famous female character in the Bible: Bathsheba? So, we should follow Muhammads example and only allow marriage at an age that is appropriate for the time. He betrayed David by joining Absaloms revolt. The Shocking Truth About Bathshebas Marriage to David in the Thus, they were following the Jewish customs of the time, which included marriage at around 12 years of age for girls. The Talmud states that Ahithophels age at the time of his death was a mere 33 years (since the sages considered 70 years to be the average lifespan). Then she returned home. King David Create. [] This was also based on the Prophets marriage to Aisha. When he realized that Absalom had not taken his advice on how to fight David, Ahithophel knew that the conspiracy against the king would fail. First, the account in Chronicles omits the sordid stories of David and Bathsheba and Absaloms revolt, and only mentions some characters in passing, so we do not have much information about Bathsheba, Eliam, or Ahithophel. Ahithophel was known as Davids counsellor, [41] https://www.studylight.org/commentaries/pmc/psalms-55.html#23, And the prayer here used is followed with another in the history, to turn the counsel of Ahitophel, an enemy of his, but held in great reputation, into foolishness., [42] https://www.studylight.org/commentary/psalms/55-13.html, My guide my counselor; as Ahithophel was to David (1 Samuel 15:12; 1 Samuel 16:23)., [43] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/kad/psalms/55.htm, This Old Testament Judas is none other than Ahithphel, the right hand of Absalom., [44] https://biblehub.com/commentaries/lange/psalms/55.htm, In retaining this reference to David, however, we are not to think of Doeg, Ps. The table below shows a summary of this information and calculations of ages for David, Ahithophel, Solomon, and Bathsheba, based on the chronology of 2 Samuel 1117. Furthermore, according to 2 Samuel 15:31, upon finding out about Ahithophel, David prayed to God to: turn Ahithophels counsel into foolishness.. Psychologist Dr. Robert Epstein has made the controversial suggestion that young people, regardless of how young, should be allowed to make decisions about marriage and sex provided that they demonstrate that he or she knows about the risks of sexis physically and emotionally mature, and so on, an arbitrary age cutoff necessarily allows incompetent people to gain rights and privileges they probably shouldnt have., The norm that the ulama did come to consensus on was only a general guideline: they prohibited sexual intercourse for girls not able to undergo it, on the basis that otherwise sex could be physically harmful. 12 Then David told Uriah, Stay here one more day. Other commentators also explain the verse this way. This verse is crucial. The Mount of Olives is adjacent to the city of Jerusalem, so David would have had a good view of the city and thus, assuming he wrote the psalm, could have been describing his feelings at the time. Second, the Chronicler seemed to indicate that Ahithophel was still alive when David was old and nearing death! Talmud Niddah 29b; Halacha is clear, ritual bath must be done during the morning hence, there is no connection with Bathsheba who took a bath during the night (2 Samuel 11:2). By the way, Im not a non-Muslim, but a Sunni Muslim and I apologize if I have by mistake made these allegations. He was the grandfather of Bathsheba.[69]. There is no reason to interpret the verse allegorically. Webrussian central bank rothschild. This elite group also included Uriah the Hittite (v. 39). In fact, the first son born to David and Bathsheba died a week after birth, as brought out in 2 Samuel 12:15 It is omitted in the list of 1 Chronicles 11:1-47, but is now probably discernible as AHIJAH the Pelonite (1 Chronicles 11:36) (see Kennicott, Dissertation, p. 207). Some Bible dictionaries mention both Eliams without any additional information. Thus, when Christians say that Muhammads (peace be upon him) marriage to Aisha (may Allah be pleased with her) was immoral, and if Muslims were to respond by saying well, the Biblical figures married young girls too, so they are also immoral, that would be a tu quoque fallacy. Perhaps there may be a reference in Psalms 41:9; Psalms 55:12-14, to Ahithophel. JazahAllahu Khair for your hard word we learn so much from you, Was iyyak. Im sorry for making a claim that makes you think that I was criticizing Islam. David asked his servants Examining Quran 9:29 - Does Islam Sanction The Killing Of Christians & Jews? The estimation of Bathshebas age is indeed based primarily on the interpretation of Psalm 55, and especially verse 23 (see objection #2 below). 2012-01-09 00:45:39. [] This was also based on the Prophets marriage to Aisha. And he did everything he could to have her. And one said, Is not this Bathsheba, the daughter of Eliam, the wife of Uriah the Hittite? So David sent messengers and took her, and she came to him, and he lay with her. Based on this seemingly contradictory information, let us follow the conservative route, as always, and assume that Solomon was around 20 years old at the time of his ascension. Appropriate for the time experts as to what age that is appropriate the. A young girl Islam Sanction the Killing of Christians & Jews old nearing... Our academic journey of determining Ahithophels age Muslim and I apologize if I have already debunked on. Messengers and took her, and I apologize if I have by mistake made allegations! 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